Back to Squawk list
  • 37

Volga-Dnepr An-124 seized at Toronto Pearson

Submitted
TORONTO, ONTARIO — An Antonov AN-124 cargo aircraft that carried COVID-19 test kits to Canada has been grounded at Toronto’s Pearson Airport as part of the international sanctions imposed on Russia after the invasion of Ukraine. (www.airlinerwatch.com) More...

Sort type: [Top] [Newest]


Ricovandijk
Rico van Dijk 19
Good, give it to Antonov in Ukraine as a start of payback for the destroyed Ан-225 Мрия
yarnoca1
John Yarno 4
I do not know much about international law. That being said, I would suspect that the plane would be impounded and held in Canada until such time, if ever, there is a ruling from an international court dealing with seized Russian assets, both government and private. At that time, any seized assets found eligible to be declared repatriations, would then be awarded as the international court decided. Again that is only my uneducated guess.
Rodstein
Marc Rodstein 5
Unless it is cared for properly, by the time a court rules it will be junk.
yarnoca1
John Yarno 1
I would suspect that it would be properly cared for, why not? That yacht which was seized would not be allowed to sink.
RainbowRiver
RainbowRiver 2
Don't know the law on seized assets, but maintenance in flying status might be hard to accomplish given the fact that Canada probably has no spare parts for the plane. As big as it is they probably don't have a hanger for it. And they likely don't have manuals for it. Cranking it up might not be a good idea ("Gee, wonder what THIS button is for? OOPS!"). Stored outside will take its toll.
paultrubits
paul trubits 1
U Tube it
21voyageur
Dan Chiasson -3
Uhhh, sorry sport but it is not Canada's to give.
silcalifano
Ukraine is not Putin's to take either.
RainbowRiver
RainbowRiver 2
Good point!
21voyageur
Dan Chiasson 0
Agree but your logic is questionable. Are you suggesting illegal activities such as what Putin is doing be applied? An eye for an eye approach will not get anybody anywhere.
marcusangelus
Mark Jenkins 10
Ownership of anything is an interesting artificial concept. For most people, we own things because we have acquired the right of ownership under a legal structure enforced by an authority having jurisdiction. In some cases, we even get a piece of paper (real estate deed, vehicle title) that proves we own it. At the level of nation states, there is no overarching entity to supply an authority having jurisdiction to enforce any legal structure. So we have some international organizations, along with treaties (agreements between countries), to provide a pseudo-authority.

When things get nasty between nation-states, the relevance of the pseudo-authority becomes questionable and ownership becomes malleable. A nation state such as Russia seizing an entire sovereign nation such as Ukraine dwarfs the seizing of assets such as Russia seizing the assets of "foreign businesses" in Russia or a country like Canada seizing assets like an airplane. As long as the seizure of assets is done according to so-called international law (i.e., enough other countries agree that it is right and proper), it is done "legally". Whether it is a good idea, and what kind of retaliation it might provoke is another question.

The seizure of all or part of a sovereign nation becomes "legal" when it goes unchallenged, like the seizure of Crimea by Russia a few years back. So far, the majority of nations appear unwilling to let a potential seizure of Ukraine go unchallenged. Part of that challenge is freezing, and possibly eventually seizing, assets under the jurisdiction of Russia.

For a parallel "legal" seizures of assets at a level that us plebes could be affected by, look up civil forfeiture under United States law.
yarnoca1
John Yarno 3
Well stated.
themcdonalds
bill mcdonald 4
Why not? As part of NATO we enforce the sanctions. This is a global effort against Putin and sanctions will prove to make the difference.
21voyageur
Dan Chiasson -2
This is not about sanctions sport, this is about legal ownership.
themcdonalds
bill mcdonald 9
Sport? Wow. Sorry “sport”, it’s all about sanctions.
21voyageur
Dan Chiasson -4
No it is not sport unless your interpretation of sanctions is the seizing of private assets. Its called civilized actions, not tooth for tooth, eye for eye
ArthurPeach
Arthur Peach 4
Seizing of private assets is one of the results, the meaning, the authorization of sanctions (punitive actions). The oligarchs yachts and money is being seized and frozen from over the world, as they should be.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 3
You clearly haven’t been following the news reference these sanctions, have you? But nice try……
RHLussier
Actually it is exactly about seizing private assets. There have been seizures of everything from luxury megayachts to private planes, to bank accounts. Assets have even be seized in Switzerland - and that has never happened. If there is no reconciliation on the part of the sanctioned, these assets belong to the government imposing the sanctions.
flybd5juan
Juan Jimenez 3
It's not Russia's to keep or complain about it. Canada can do with it what it will do with the seized Russian sovereign wealth assets. All Putin can do is whine.
eichmat
Tim Eichman 1
Nor are the foreign owned aircraft leased to Russian airlines, but it looks like Russia is about to "take" all of them (though I'm sure if that happens, non will ever fly internationally again, otherwise Airplane Repo will be making a big comeback...

See this Squawk about it: https://flightaware.com/squawks/view/1/7_days/popular/88271/Russia_proposes_registering_leased_planes_as_airlines_property
ExCalbr
Victor Engel 6
Is it seized or is it grounded? It looks to me like they were playing fast and loose with terminology here.
21voyageur
Dan Chiasson -1
Agreed and typical of this site not applying proper due diligence. More eyeball bait.
Viperguy46
Jesse Carroll 3
Can't the Rustskis copy anyone else's airplanes. Paint this one OD and it turns back into a C5!
fredlaemmerhirt
For all you uninformed; the company has a bond debt for over $1.7 BILLION! Can you guess who has the Bond on the loan? If you guess a United States bank you win the booby prize. Seizing the plane, thus halting the company’s revenue will likely cause a default on the loan. So who are the real losers?
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle 1
Exact Fred, it's like the 550 Airbuses and Boeings leased to Russian airlines which are now grounded. Russia stopped paying the leases, the planes are sitting on Russian soil and the western leasing companies are on the verge of bankruptcies.
Without maintenance and spare parts they won't be able to be flown out of Russia.
Same for 45 Airbuses on order by Russian airlines. Orders have been cancelled pure and simple.
What about the European Space Agency? the 6 launches of 2022 are cancelled because Russia is not supplying the Soyouz rockets for the launches. Russia recalled the 110 Russian specialists who worked in French Guyana on the launching pad.
Europe has no heavy launcher until Ariane 6 is produced and tested.
So how to do the pickup of astronauts at the ISS? Only option: Space X but Elon Musk is supporting the Russians.
Another boomerang is the Russian Process rocket used to readjust the ISS orbit. If not readjusted periodically the ISS slowly looses altitude then would reenter the atmosphere and would burn.
Meanwhile all the far-eastern airlines have flying back and forth over Russia between the far-east and Europe. They picke up all the traffic.
Lufthansa CEO said European airlines could not compete by adding 2.5 hours flight time at today's jet fuel cost.
So Asians are laughing all the way to the banks.
rgohringer
rgohringer 4
Elon Musk is supporting the Russians???? Maybe some facts need checking? https://fortune.com/2022/03/10/tesla-email-ukraine-russia-invasion-starlink-spacex-elon-musk/

I think Space X is good for ISS
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle 1
Space X has no contract with the European Space Agency.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 3
Hardly! Wasn’t MH 17 that was shot down over Ukraine some years ago an ASIAN airline?
Ask the Malaysians if they’re laughing, I highly doubt it!
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle -1
MH17 may have been shot down by an Ukrainian missile. You may have missed the latest results of the investigation.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10550567/Buk-missile-type-used-shoot-MH17-spotted-Ukraine.html
The constructor of the BUK missile confirmed MH17 was shot down by an older model BUK 1 operational in Ukraine. Russia does not have anymore this type of missile. They used the BUK 2 at the time of the accident.
Photos of BUK 1 in Ukraine have resurfaced.
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35706048
UU539771
mark robinson 3
Well, comrade, the Daily Mail article you refer to is nothing but film of BUK missiles being transported - absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the latest results of the investigation. Also, the BBC link is to an article from 6 years ago, talking about the various conspiracy theories doing the rounds at the time. It certainly doesn't draw any conclusions but does mainly debunk most of these theories. And much more evidence has come to light since the date of that report.
You, sir, are just trying to introduce a few red herrings and make yourself sound like an authority on the subject when you clearly are not.
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle -1
It’s funny how the conspiracy theorists of yesterday become the truth revealers of today.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 1
No conspiracy theories here! This is real, just ask th3 Netherlands and Australia.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/14/australia-and-the-netherlands-launch-legal-action-against-russia-over-mh17-disaster
alexa320
alex hidveghy 2
Irrespective, you miss my point. You said the Asians were laughing. I said I doubt it very much. MAS is an Asian airline that got shot down flying through a war zone - irrespective of who shot it down- ergo ALL civilian traffic needs to avoid overflying a combat zone. Basic air safety 101.
Or do people ignore history? What’s your risk tolerance?
BTW, I did NOT mention who or what shot it down. That was the conclusion you jumped to. Knee jerk reaction, maybe?!
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle 0
If you look at the airline traffic between Europe and the Far-East and flying over Russian territory at 1:30 pm today, you ‘ll see the enormous amounts of Chinese, UAE, Far-Eastern and Russian airlines.
I have a screen shot which doesn’t lie.
The hypocrisy of this situation shows well when you see DHL cargo plane flying across Russia.
DHL is a German logistics company but they have a contract with Aviastar with Russian Tupolev registered aircrafts.
So no sanctions for them.
Flight 4B9601 is flying over Russia east bound at this time.
For insurance purpose they won’t fly over Ukraine but pass north or south of the border.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 2
Um, the war is in Ukraine, not Russia! That is the danger zone, not Russia. That’s where MH17 went down. Your last sentence is what I’m talking about. Ukraine airspace right now is not safe for any civilian airlines to fly over. That’s why everyone is rerouted!
As for Russia, the vast majority of western airlines avoid it because if the sanctions. Russians friends, Chinese, are not subject to either NATO, EU or any other sanctions inferred by the west.
I also see your previous comment on this has been shot down by another poster!
fwaviator63
A. Highsmith 1
Why be concerned with what the world court thinks. Nobody thinks they have any jurisdiction over anything and certainly not the Russians.
ArthurPeach
Arthur Peach 1
The plane was "grounded". Does this mean confiscated by the government, and the crew sent back by other means. Or does it mean grounded until the war is over? O could it mean that the plane is turned over to the Ukraine for their use in the war effort. What is happening with the (Russian?) crew? Still lots of questions. Who knows the answers.? Interesting to speculate, but not very constructive.
flybd5juan
Juan Jimenez 2
It means the plane won't be going anywhere. How the crew gets back to Russia is their problem.
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle 0
It's not a problem. Air China, China Eastern, Hainan Airlines or any far-eastern airlines will repatriate them for free via Beijing, Shanghai or Chengdu.
UU539771
mark robinson 2
Really? For free? Come on - why would they do that? And why travel three-quarters of the way around the world?
All their company has to do is buy tickets home from Toronto on Turkish Airlines via Istanbul, like almost everyone is doing at the moment from North America to Russia or vice versa.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 2
Well stated! I think Patrick is being rather disingenuous and defensive.
fredbrillo111
Fred B Rillo 1
It means the nose wheel has been chained to the ground till further notice and the aircraft has been "Arrested"till further notice.
CPAIR007
JASON AWID 1
This is so sad . Saw her here in EDMONTON many years ago when NAMEO here was a actual RCAF base . Unlike today ... Canadian Army and 2 helicopters ..
xmitr
Don Whyte 1
Spelled Namao
CPAIR007
JASON AWID 1
Wrong post .. oops.. this reply was concerning the MIGHTY A-225
dpadhye
dpadhye 1
So China made critical COVID test kits, a Russian cargo operator ferried them to Canada. Canada says 'Thank You' by grounding that plane. US wants to pick up fight with both China and Russia. Way to go!
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle 0
In conclusion the loosers are going to be the Europeans and the Americans.
Russia has a market of China, India, South Asia, S.E.Asia and African countries which did not vote against Russia at the last UN General Assembly.
It's almost 3 billions people who need mineral resources and have no climate change ideology.
Xi Jiping must have the best time of his life.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 0
It’s losers, not loosers!
Also, 3 billion, not 3 billions!
Did you graduate high school or is this yoyr best writing?!🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤷🏼‍♂️
pwahle2012
Patrick Wahle 2
English is my third language. If I use French, German or Spanish you may have some difficulties to understand and correct my mistakes.
Anyway thanks for the tip.
alexa320
alex hidveghy 2
You’re welcome!
From someone that speaks and understands three European languages besides English!!
sgbelverta
sharon bias 0
I'm glad the Canadian company got their goods, but it just shows how stupid Russia is right now to actually allow them to be shipped.
21voyageur
Dan Chiasson 2
Actually it was the government that had the agreement in place not a "company".

Login

Don't have an account? Register now (free) for customized features, flight alerts, and more!
This website uses cookies. By using and further navigating this website, you accept this.
Dismiss
Did you know that FlightAware flight tracking is supported by advertising?
You can help us keep FlightAware free by allowing ads from FlightAware.com. We work hard to keep our advertising relevant and unobtrusive to create a great experience. It's quick and easy to whitelist ads on FlightAware or please consider our premium accounts.
Dismiss