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2ND IN A MONTH - Wing snag grounds yet another AI Dreamliner

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New Delhi: In yet another Dreamliner trouble, Air India’s Delhi-Frankfurt flight on Saturday was cancelled as the Boeing-787 earmarked for the route developed a snag leaving over 150 passengers stranded here. Several of the brand new aircraft VT-ANM’s spoilers – speed retardation devices on the wings that move up and down – became unserviceable and the aircraft had to be grounded. “We are arranging for a replacement Dreamliner and the Frankfurt flight (AI 121 which was to depart at 1 pm on… (epaper.timesofindia.com) More...

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PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 5
Most AI's 78 delays have nothing to do with mx issues. Most of AI service interruptions have to do with the regulator failing to properly certify the plane for low visibility operations, which is huge problem at foggy Delhi. Hope they [the regulator and the airline] get in gear soon.

Makes no sense to complain about a reliability rate that is about 1% lower than some of the most reliable twins at a similar early point in their respective development. Makes more sense to fix the much larger number of delayed departures and diverted arrivals, due to the fog issue.

If the Indian fog-related delays are counted against the entire fleet's reliability, that alone may account for a big chunk of the slightly lower average reliability fleet wide. No other country has failed to certify the plane for operations in low visibility. It's hard to understand why the Indians are dragging their feet.
mfcdvm
Michael Curley 2
Is this what they call a "spoiler alert" Sorry, I couldn't help it.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
A lot of this I would attribute to crew training, and reliance on automation... A few examples: West Caribbean Airways Flight 708, Colgan Air Flight 3407, Northwest Airlines Flight 255 and the list goes on.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 0
An interesting but worrisome news paper story on a very important festival day morning , the festival of colours celebrated by Hindus all over the world

" Dreamliner snag spoils Holi for flyers "

Link
http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/Scripting/ArticleWin.asp?From=Archive&Source=Page&Skin=TOINEW&BaseHref=CAP/2014/03/17&PageLabel=11&EntityId=Ar01100&ViewMode=HTML

The Boeing 787 Dreamliner’s unending snags have now poured cold water on the Holi celebration plans of almost 250 people who were supposed to fly out of Paris late on Saturday to reach Delhi on Sunday morning, in time for the festival of colors.Air India’s flight AI 142, to be operated on Dreamliner (VT-AND), had to be grounded just when it was to take off from Paris CDG Airport on Saturday night as the aircraft’s spoilers ...... became unserviceable and the aircraft had to be grounded. ........
AI CMD Rohit Nandan very sternly raised the issue of Dreamliner’s constant snags with Boeing vice-president Dinesh Keskar at last week’s recent Hyderabad air show. The exasperated airline has gone to the extent of asking Boeing to be answerable for each snag. ........

Nandan is reportedly learnt to have asked Boeing to station its personnel in India and explain each and every fault that leads to grounding of Dreamliners. “Whenever there is a B-787 problem, the media rightly calls AI to know why it happened. The answers for that are with Boeing and they better explain the same as our focus at times like those are to minimize passenger suffering. We are getting a lot of flak because of Boeing,” said an official.
Attempts to reach Boeing for getting their version on the endemic problems of the Dreamliners, each time a snag grounds, delays or leads to return of an aircraft mid-way from destination, prove futile. .........

Hello Boeing ! Any body there ?
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal -3
Aviation secretary Ashok Lavasa has asked AI to get in touch with other airlines using the Dreamliner and see if they too are facing similar issues. He has directed AI to examine if these are teething troubles with a new plane or something else, marking the first tough stance by the ministry on the troublesome Dreamliner issue.
This is the second spoiler trouble for Dreamliner in a month. In early January, an AI B-787 had to be grounded in Hong Kong after the actuator of its wing spoilers broke. A spoiler acts as a speed breaker on an aircraft. Without this important device perfectly functional, an airplane simply can’t be allowed to get airborne. A senior AI official said the airline is seeking compensation from Boeing for three counts of the Dreamliner – the over three year delay in delivery of the aircraft; grounding of this aircraft for four months last year and for failure to meet “guaranteed performance” standards of fuel consumption.
preacher1
preacher1 4
Well, at the risk of finger pointing, I don't think this issue has raised it's head outside of AI. They are a speed retardation to a point but are primarily for killing lift on landing, disrupting the airflow over the wing, and allowing the weight of the aircraft settle on the wheels, hence the name SPOILER, as it SPOILS the airflow over the wing. While not recommended, if a pilot knows there is a problem with them and a long enough runway, you can get a plane down if you pay attention to what you're doing.
linbb
linbb 3
And what kind of mechanics do they have working on them? Read the one above you before you knock Boeing as it seems they have more trouble that others. Could be a problem like the stolen filters on someone else's 787 AC. Also could be that they are either short of funds, have Airbus trying to sell them replacements of there's at a lower price. Somewhere hidden they have an agenda for something wait and see.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
The plane is so new, there is probably a shortage of trained mechanics... Every a/c in the world has had these issues... Crews need more training as well as the mechanics.
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 1
The Only hidden agenda I can see is a collusion between the state-owned Air India and the government regulator (which is directly controlled by the state (India) that also owns the airline to blame Air India's poor results on Boeing, or at least be able to extract some benefit whether ut be a financial payment or merely a scape goat.

I've been calling it simple incompetence. But maybe it's a conspiracy instead.
preacher1
preacher1 1
That's a pretty good size agenda; it's called CYA and get what you can out of those deep pockets. They are the bad guy that caused all this. We are airline officials and government officials. We can do no wrong.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal -1
Boeing mechanics, employed by Boeing, all crew of a specially created service center by Boeing in India , perhaps in New Delhi (?) to serve South and east Asia !
Will it help ?
preacher1
preacher1 3
To the best of my knowledge, AI did not take the Boeing offered GOLD FLEET service in their BUY contract. Had they done so, this would have been very similar to what you are talking about. Instead, they went on their own, as most every other purchaser did, and they are about the only ones having the problem. Do you not think that on a new plane that is under a microscope as the 787 is, that if this were widespread, the world would have already known about it?
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 0
Recently in the context of 787 problems faced by Norwegians Airline some expert Americans of this august forum commented very adversely, on lines similar to what they always do for Asians. And all this INSPITE of having the Gold Fleet service !
preacher1
preacher1 1
Well, AI does not have it so that puts the monkey back at home, doesn't it? And most of the adverse comments I saw were toward Boeing for slow response. There have been adverse comments toward Norwegian by some 121's but I haven't seen much by individuals.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 0
Dear preacher1 , we have many maladies that ail our systems in general and Aviation in particular. ( that is why we are lagging inspite of having some of the best brains in the world in almost all fields ! ) :-(
This minor down grading by FAA is working as an eye opener.
Let us wait and see when and how much change occurs ? Given the policy paralysis , so peculiar to most democracies !
preacher1
preacher1 1
Fine with me. Seems you are the one that started the bad mouthing on this dialogue. I just made a comment about AI but you seem to have jumped in with all the prejudicial comments and trying to turn the argument. I'm outa here.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 0
Sorry for this impression. But there are some 'experts' on this portal who specialize in berating Asians/Indians and will spare no effort in doing that.
I personal life, I am far far removed from such prejudicial or racial thoughts , whether in professional life or social.
That's why I consider the world as a global village and feel extremely pained and uncomfortable when some one makes illogical remarks based on ethnicity !
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 1
The FAA downgrade is anyhing but minor. It oea not allow new service by Indian airlines to US nor does it allow US airlines o add code shares on Indian airlines.

The FAA downgrade is indicative of severe deficiencies in the relevant country's regulatory framework and enforcement. These downgrades are not taken lightly nor arbitrarily

There are many countries around the world with substantial deficiencies. That the Indian regulator's incompetence has gotten bad enough for a downgrade is a badge of shame for India. There are only a small handful of countries in the world who's regulatory oversight is bad enough to have resulted in a downgrade.

That the Indians are taking the downgrade seriously and acting to correct some of the deficiencies so quickly, is a good thing. (despite the impression your dismissive comments might suggest).

While the Euro and US regulators' downgrade list don't always match exactly, there is often overlap. Any country getting downgraded by one regulator gets a closer look from other regulators and may result in further downgrades from other jurisdictions. That would be devastating for Indian airlines, most which are already struggling.

The FAA had been consulted to help improve the situation in India. That they felt it necessary to downgrade, shows that there was little progress.

Hopefully the current steps will not just be window dressing and will result in long lasting improvements.

Good luck.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 1
Would you be so kind to state your your hidden agenda in short ?
You hate Indians out right. As well as Asians. That is so obvious.
So no need to repeat it in various ways.
PhotoFinish
PhotoFinish 1
No. I don't hate Indians. But YOU Shoukd be very, very disappointed in your aviation regulator. Maybe you can blame the corruption, lack of effective enforcement, and failure to do a competent job on your former colonial governors. But hey, otters can feel free to call that a cop out.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 0
Our democracy is just 65 years old.
Yours is well over 225 years.
Have you settled down ?
I doubt !
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
If you are talking about the US, 225 year democracy, keep in mind that the US is a "REPUBLIC" and is not a "DEMOCRACY". There are a lot of similarities, but is NOT the same thing.

Note the Pledge Of Allegiance: "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

Pay particular attention to the statement: "and to the republic for which it stands"

REPUBLIC: "A republic is a form of government in which power is held by the people and representatives they elect,"

DEMOCRACY: "Democracy is a form of government in which all eligible citizens participate equally—either directly or indirectly through elected representative"

There are a lot of similarities, but clearly different... Many elected officials as well as other American's do not realize this.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal 1
Kindly stop playing the law and lawyer card.
Please.
Let us stick to aviation and Americans hating Indians.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
I see you are not one of the ones who understands the difference... Sorry to hear that. Not playing any cards... Just trying to correct a severe misunderstanding that leads so many in the wrong direction by those who do not know the difference.
preacher1
preacher1 2
Point of the whole thing is that there is not any racism exhibited here. There are aviation facts & comments, based on the fact that air travel started here and has developed to where it is with others playing catch up. Doesn't matter if it's India or S. Korea. If it is below our standards, then it is behind, based on the only comparison we have.
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal -6
For those who hate Indians in particular and Asians in general, I repeat what the Aviation Secretary instructed to AI to do
" Aviation secretary Ashok Lavasa has asked AI to get in touch with other airlines using the Dreamliner and see if they too are facing similar issues. He has directed AI to examine if these are teething troubles with a new plane or something else, marking the first tough stance by the ministry on the troublesome Dreamliner issue. "
Does it seem reasonable approach or evasive kind ? What would the most intelligent race ( the Americans ) on Earth thinks ?
I know my comment will thoroughly 'down voted' , naturally by Americans , en mass and exclusively.
God bless Americans .
bishops90
Brian Bishop 3
Sounds like you're the one with the racist attitude sir. If you left out the references to Americans and hatred etc ad nauseum, you would've had a reasonably intelligent comment here. Too bad you ruined it with your vitriole.

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